For these pastors, it's as if the Age of Reason never occurred. History tells us that nothing good ever comes for societies dominated by such religious zealots.
While I believe in Israel’s right to exist, I am also believe in a loving God. As such, I do not believe a loving God approves and supports Israel’s treatment of the people in Gaza; withholding food and medical aid, bombing hospitals, shooting civilians standing in line for food and the continued expansion of settlements on the West Bank. Support for Israel should not mean supporting these atrocities or denying freedom of speech to those who protest against them. Yes, Israel is our ally, but they depend much more on our help than we do theirs. We should use the influence we have to dissuade them from these horrific policies.
Both of these reflect the irreconcilable duality of humans and our religions. Every time I see it mentioned I always wonder how many evangelicals and others believe we need to do everything we can to end the world for the greater good. The fact those listening to the prophet in the Twain essay considered him a lunatic shows how easy it is to ignore the realities of the means necessary to achieve conquest - and to believe conquest is a good thing with no downsides. I saw the side of Twain reflected by this essay in his posthumously published THE MYSTERIOUS STRANGER, a work of true nihilism. Interestingly, a group of Twain scholars decided it did not reflect his true intent and had a different version published based on their research of his copious notes and what they considered his final draft of the novel (No. 44, THE MYSTERIOUS STANGER). It is different in almost every way from the first edition and reflects the style of other of his books with which I am familiar. Anyhow, your post makes it abundantly clear that truth becomes even more elusive when reality is actively ignored.
Seeing the destruction of Gaza , an estimated 56,152 Palestinians have been killed by Netanyahu with full support from US Christian Nationalists, and recalling that enslavers used the Bible to justify slavery, makes me yearn for the good ole days when church and state were separate.
Gaza is small, only 141 square miles in land area, smaller than Orleans Parish’s 180 square miles. Gaza is the Palestinians homeland. The US should have learned something from Vietnam! Yet Trump wants to expel Palestinians.
This is eye opening and frightening. Yet, I consider all of the people you sighted as not being fringe to be very much part of the fringe element. Therefore, I suppose the fringe element has become a part of the establishment. We now have to realize the importance of our founding fathers’ desire to establish the principle of separation of church and state.
We forget that the King (or Queen) of the United Kingdom is also Supreme Governor of the Church of England. The Church and State were one. The original patriots and thinkers who would start the American Revolution and create democracy were very conscious of how a combination of Church and State created prejudice and disenfranchised those who had different beliefs. The First Amendment was intended to be a clear, unambiguous repudiation of giving one religion preference over another, or undue influence. An amendment whose meaning has been lost, it seems
I am a conservative but am seriously concerned that both sides (conservatives, liberals and other meaningless labels) find it hard to sit down and reach any consensus. Our country is so polarized it is dividing families and friends and results in our nation’s failure in addressing the biggest hurdle - it’s national debt. It will take sacrifices all sides will detest to bring our over spending and silly tax cuts under control so we don’t leave a mess for our children and grandchildren. I am not for the big, beautiful bill - not because of its source - but because it simply doesn’t FIX the problem. We have a spending problem and certainly don’t need the recommended tax cuts. We are a great nation and only when both sides (and yes, that means you and me) stop addressing the other side’s flaws and start talking to one other will we ever reach constructively - a compromise on reducing our nation’s debt. It’s time we come together effectively and efficiently and TALK.
As much as I, a liberal, agree with you, there’s a fundamental problem we have yet to overcome. Negotiation means compromise. Compromise only comes when both parties come to the table willing to listen to each other, and to offer concessions to get an agreement that both can accept. When one party believes that they are always right, anyone who disagrees is the enemy and must be destroyed, and that compromise is surrender? How do you negotiate with people who are not willing to do so in good faith?
These “devout Christians“ who proclaim their devotion to Israel, are IMHO, actually trying to wipe out Israel and Jews! They just can’t wait to have everyone “worship Jesus!“ It’s the height of hypocrisy, and insulting to the intelligence of those who practice Judaism!
Be careful with what you seek from your lord almighty, regardless of how your desired ends might seem to justify any means to achieve them. An inattentive-or even complicit-Almighty often approves your request. Gods are “ relative” when it comes to morality.
When you combine sodium and chloride, you get salt through a very violent reaction. When foreign policy is controlled by Christian Zionists who want to help bring about the apocalypse along with war-mongering Neocons who want to make money for the military-industrial complex, you can't avoid another disastrous war. But unlike the Iraq War, this one could have much more devastating consequences.
I concur with Mr. Winham. I would not trust Gov. Huckabee's advice on anything. I do trust and believe most pastors/priest/ministers are called to do good via history and the scriptures. But being human, many flaws develop. Being a country boy in Richland Parish, Holly Ridge, La. I was born rich with much love and attention, I attended all of the Churches, even help dig a grave for a Mormon, who was sitting on his front porch. Yes, I am a believer. My favorite prayer from "The Right Stuff", A. Shepherd, waiting to blast off, God don't let me f**k up now. Keep learning and Keep loving! thanks
Turning to Mark Twain's wisdom leads me to consider how far we have or have not gotten past the fundamentalist reaction against biblical studies that are not strictly fundamentalistic. Christian fundamentalist are more numerous and prowerful than they were almost 100 yeas ago when the scopes trail led to broad ridicule of literal reading of scripture. With the rise of fundamentalist political empowerment isince the last quarter of the 29th century the harm done to the Christian community is incalculable. The impact on society in each of its realms of politics, culture, and economics is serious and dangerous. The destruction in Israel and Iran are clear examples of how Chritianity, Islam, and Judaism are being affected by the spread and empowerment of religious fundamentalism. The rising danger cannot be overstated.
For these pastors, it's as if the Age of Reason never occurred. History tells us that nothing good ever comes for societies dominated by such religious zealots.
While I believe in Israel’s right to exist, I am also believe in a loving God. As such, I do not believe a loving God approves and supports Israel’s treatment of the people in Gaza; withholding food and medical aid, bombing hospitals, shooting civilians standing in line for food and the continued expansion of settlements on the West Bank. Support for Israel should not mean supporting these atrocities or denying freedom of speech to those who protest against them. Yes, Israel is our ally, but they depend much more on our help than we do theirs. We should use the influence we have to dissuade them from these horrific policies.
Both of these reflect the irreconcilable duality of humans and our religions. Every time I see it mentioned I always wonder how many evangelicals and others believe we need to do everything we can to end the world for the greater good. The fact those listening to the prophet in the Twain essay considered him a lunatic shows how easy it is to ignore the realities of the means necessary to achieve conquest - and to believe conquest is a good thing with no downsides. I saw the side of Twain reflected by this essay in his posthumously published THE MYSTERIOUS STRANGER, a work of true nihilism. Interestingly, a group of Twain scholars decided it did not reflect his true intent and had a different version published based on their research of his copious notes and what they considered his final draft of the novel (No. 44, THE MYSTERIOUS STANGER). It is different in almost every way from the first edition and reflects the style of other of his books with which I am familiar. Anyhow, your post makes it abundantly clear that truth becomes even more elusive when reality is actively ignored.
Seeing the destruction of Gaza , an estimated 56,152 Palestinians have been killed by Netanyahu with full support from US Christian Nationalists, and recalling that enslavers used the Bible to justify slavery, makes me yearn for the good ole days when church and state were separate.
Gaza is small, only 141 square miles in land area, smaller than Orleans Parish’s 180 square miles. Gaza is the Palestinians homeland. The US should have learned something from Vietnam! Yet Trump wants to expel Palestinians.
Opening soon: Trump Gaza Country Club. 141 square miles of beautiful land, ready for you to visit. And no pesky Palestinians!
This is eye opening and frightening. Yet, I consider all of the people you sighted as not being fringe to be very much part of the fringe element. Therefore, I suppose the fringe element has become a part of the establishment. We now have to realize the importance of our founding fathers’ desire to establish the principle of separation of church and state.
We forget that the King (or Queen) of the United Kingdom is also Supreme Governor of the Church of England. The Church and State were one. The original patriots and thinkers who would start the American Revolution and create democracy were very conscious of how a combination of Church and State created prejudice and disenfranchised those who had different beliefs. The First Amendment was intended to be a clear, unambiguous repudiation of giving one religion preference over another, or undue influence. An amendment whose meaning has been lost, it seems
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/06/21/opinion/political-violence-right-wing.html
I am a conservative but am seriously concerned that both sides (conservatives, liberals and other meaningless labels) find it hard to sit down and reach any consensus. Our country is so polarized it is dividing families and friends and results in our nation’s failure in addressing the biggest hurdle - it’s national debt. It will take sacrifices all sides will detest to bring our over spending and silly tax cuts under control so we don’t leave a mess for our children and grandchildren. I am not for the big, beautiful bill - not because of its source - but because it simply doesn’t FIX the problem. We have a spending problem and certainly don’t need the recommended tax cuts. We are a great nation and only when both sides (and yes, that means you and me) stop addressing the other side’s flaws and start talking to one other will we ever reach constructively - a compromise on reducing our nation’s debt. It’s time we come together effectively and efficiently and TALK.
As much as I, a liberal, agree with you, there’s a fundamental problem we have yet to overcome. Negotiation means compromise. Compromise only comes when both parties come to the table willing to listen to each other, and to offer concessions to get an agreement that both can accept. When one party believes that they are always right, anyone who disagrees is the enemy and must be destroyed, and that compromise is surrender? How do you negotiate with people who are not willing to do so in good faith?
These “devout Christians“ who proclaim their devotion to Israel, are IMHO, actually trying to wipe out Israel and Jews! They just can’t wait to have everyone “worship Jesus!“ It’s the height of hypocrisy, and insulting to the intelligence of those who practice Judaism!
Be careful with what you seek from your lord almighty, regardless of how your desired ends might seem to justify any means to achieve them. An inattentive-or even complicit-Almighty often approves your request. Gods are “ relative” when it comes to morality.
When you combine sodium and chloride, you get salt through a very violent reaction. When foreign policy is controlled by Christian Zionists who want to help bring about the apocalypse along with war-mongering Neocons who want to make money for the military-industrial complex, you can't avoid another disastrous war. But unlike the Iraq War, this one could have much more devastating consequences.
I concur with Mr. Winham. I would not trust Gov. Huckabee's advice on anything. I do trust and believe most pastors/priest/ministers are called to do good via history and the scriptures. But being human, many flaws develop. Being a country boy in Richland Parish, Holly Ridge, La. I was born rich with much love and attention, I attended all of the Churches, even help dig a grave for a Mormon, who was sitting on his front porch. Yes, I am a believer. My favorite prayer from "The Right Stuff", A. Shepherd, waiting to blast off, God don't let me f**k up now. Keep learning and Keep loving! thanks
Turning to Mark Twain's wisdom leads me to consider how far we have or have not gotten past the fundamentalist reaction against biblical studies that are not strictly fundamentalistic. Christian fundamentalist are more numerous and prowerful than they were almost 100 yeas ago when the scopes trail led to broad ridicule of literal reading of scripture. With the rise of fundamentalist political empowerment isince the last quarter of the 29th century the harm done to the Christian community is incalculable. The impact on society in each of its realms of politics, culture, and economics is serious and dangerous. The destruction in Israel and Iran are clear examples of how Chritianity, Islam, and Judaism are being affected by the spread and empowerment of religious fundamentalism. The rising danger cannot be overstated.
Joe Morris Doss
Israel is not a state, Palestine is not a battlefield, Israel is a death cult, Palestine is a graveyard